So someone posted a link to a video about Barack Obama and a firestorm erupted. I'm linking to this because I posted a couple of comments which may make sense to many people. My screen name is Ayrab.
My posts were primarily in response to another member called Damon. Things got pretty heated between Damon's response and the other fellows on the site before I had a chance to post my second reply. My posts were meant to discuss specific points with him on the forum. These posts may have gotten lost in maelstrom so I'll put the sequence of events and responses here as well...
Oh wow - what utter propagandist crap. Even Creationists would stand in awe of such masterful use of out of context quotes and misinformation. Seems like half that video is about his name, and the other half is about his pastor.
Watch out everyone! His name is Hussein and he went to a Muslim school! He's obviously an islamic terrorist!
My name is Greek. I am not Greek.
I went to a Catholic school for a decade. I am not Catholic.
I hate to break it to you fundie right-wingers, but your pastors are ten times crazier than Obama's. They just package their crazy to the liking of their audiences, just as Reverend Wright packages his crazy to the liking of his audience.
My First Response:
I disagree with you Damon. the quotes are not out of context, nor are they misinformation. These are actual facts and in-context quotations about the man's life. Now, I can agree if you're saying that painting him as a Muslim is a stretch. However, the comments that he and his wife, and his pastor, have made are so absolutely ludicrous that as a citizen, a naturalized citizen no-less, I personally find them offensive...and he wants to be our president? I am not a propagandist. I look for facts before making judgment.
I've lived here for 32 of my 37 years and seem to love this country, and believe in this country, more than people who were born here. This is the best country in the world! We give more than any other country across the board, in blood, sweat, tears and money.
This man's character is not what he's making it out to be and that's what this video is trying to bring across. I've been following the election coverage closely. I find it disheartening that anyone can fall for such an empty suit. The man speaks well but says nothing. His pastor speaks too much and IS A RACIST. The entire Democratic Party race baits and blames Republicans. Little do people know that it was the Democrats that started the KKK.
I agree with you saying that Wright is "packaging his crazy to the liking of his audience", but he's still preaching racism, and everyone in the audience is gleefully nodding and going along. Obama is a liar, and a politician, which are pretty much synonymous.
Obama and his wife are covering up their true beliefs, especially his wife. I personally think she wears the pants in the family and he just goes along with it. I understand that the general belief of the Democratic Party is that all people should be provided for. However, his form of government is not how we are going to survive as a nation. He will tax us to death and so will Clinton, and possibly McCain. I may be a Republican, but I'm not blind, nor am I stupid. I'm not a Kool-Aid drinker, and I'm not a racist, and I'm surely not a right wing nut job.
By the way, I was born Christian, and now I'm an atheist, but I still believe in this country, its values, and what it stands for. I also believe in one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all. This is not hypocrisy -- it's love of country above all else.
At least I know where I stand. Now it would be grand if we knew where our elected officials stand. In some cases, it's plain as day.
Damons 2nd Response:
AyRab, you need to post more often! It's refreshing to see such a well thought-out post, even though I don't fully agree with you.
I say the quotes were out of context because, in all cases, there is a lengthy and satisfactory explanation for the issues addressed, such as the flag pin and the failure to place hand over heart during the anthem. To me, it seems as though Obama is not concerned with the pomp, ceremony, pageantry, and symbolism many folks try to pass off as patriotism. I think he feels as though we should judge him by his actions, rather than by his adherence to silly ritual. As a former Catholic, I can relate to and respect this attitude.
I see nothing wrong with his wife's comment. This country has been mismanaged into a sad mockery of itself, and I see no reason to be proud of the current state of affairs. Further, I find national pride kind of silly in the first place. I was born here. I've always been a US citizen, and I had no choice in the matter. Therefore, while I'm certainly happy to be an American, it is, in my opinion, foolish to be proud of something I had no control over.
I couldn’t care less about his pastor. All pastors preach nonsense, and very few have anything meaningful to contribute. Reverent Wright gets the white folks fired up because he’s preaching against white people, as opposed to white pastors who preach against gays, fornicators, and anyone else they don’t like that day. In the end, it’s just more meaningless pastoral drivel that can be safely ignored.
After listening to Obama’s speeches, especially those concerning faith, I somewhat suspect he’s a closet atheist, and only pretends to be a Christian to keep the fundies happy. It’s his bad luck that he chose a firebrand, racist pastor.
He does speak well, but you’re right – he sometimes lacks depth and perspective. He may very well be covering up his true beliefs, but that can be said for just about anyone, anywhere, any time. I don’t see it as an automatic deal-breaker. Heh - perhaps so many people are "taken in" by such a fine speaker because, for the last eight years, we've dealt with a president who sounds functionally illiterate.
On a personal note, you say you weren’t born here, and your handle seems to be a reference to “Arab”. Out of curiosity, where are you from? I used to live in Egypt, w ana atakalam alarabiya showaya.
My 2nd Response:
I started this before I left work...I got home and there were 2 pages worth of posts. JEEZ!!! You guys are f'n crazy!!! :)
Here is my response to Damon's post....
Damon, unfortunately, I used Ayrab as a screen name but it's misleading. I'm not Arab. I was born on the Christian side in Beirut, Lebanon, 1971. My family left the country due to civil war in 1976 and I've been here since.
I'm Lebanese by birth, American by choice.
To me it's not pomp and circumstance, and definitely not a silly ritual, to put your hand over your heart in front of the flag or wear the colors -- all the time. It's a showing of respect to your nation, all of the people within and especially to those who have put their lives on the line to keep it safe and free. We are indebted to these men and women. The flag symbolizes all that we stand for within this country. It's not just the counts of colonies and states on it. It's US! You, me and all of the people that live under it. We need to be loyal to our country, its flag, its heritage and its rituals. This is a prerequisite, in my eyes, to being a patriot.
You may not have had a choice but you should still be proud that you are an American. Many people come here from Mexico and are proud to be Mexican, and they don't hesitate in telling you and/or showing you. If you let others be prouder about there countries than you are of your's, then where will we be in the future?
His wife's comments, though they are allowed, are quite hurtful to us as a nation across the oceans. It's bad enough that we have other countries saying this kind of crap. We don't need our own people talking badly about the the greatest nation on Earth. As much as things are broken, we are still the one nation in this world that can lead others. The one nation that can assist and defend the weaker. We are the one good nation remaining that has the might, the money, the will and the balls. Any statements to the contrary only embolden our enemies within and abroad. This is why I have extreme views on why our politicians should not denegrate this country with their words. If Michelle Obama, hasn't been proud of the country that allowed her to become a highly educated and successful attorney then maybe she should move to Saudi Arabia - at least she'll have a right to vote. :)
Moving on...
We can generalize and say that all pastors preach nonsense, but at least the majority still understand love, caring, and affection for one and all, and most still preach this. So, I can't really state that all preachers preach nothing. From the standpoint of religion, I'll agree that it's nonsense, but it helps many people. I'm not one of those crazy atheists that wants to do away with all religion, because people believe, and many benefit from it. However, we can do away with the crazy-religious freaks that exist in all circles, but that's a book I'm not willing to write in this post.
For me, it goes a little deeper than that pertaining to Mr. Wright. His hatred is showing, evolving, growing and spreading. He's a Jesse Jackson, an Al Sharpton and a Farrakhan all wrapped into one. His type of language is detrimental to this nation and its people, primarily the black people. We've made progress, with regards to civil rights, over the past 50 years and it shows. However, there are many who don't want to allow progress to continue and would still like to see a segregated society, AND I'M NOT TALKING WHITE PEOPLE! Yes, there may still be a great deal of harbored antipathy by many Black Americans, but they can't be blind to the progress that has been made. Things aren't perfect but they're progressing.
Wright's terms can only be used to seed additional angst in the black population. Instead of preaching positive aspects of life: Education, hard work, success in your endeavors, charity, self-reliance vs. dependence, and TRUE patriotism. He provides his audience ammunition and rope. The ammunition is to take aim and fire at all of us who believe in the common man, and really want people to succeed, but are being slighted by his words. And the rope is for them to hang themselves with, once they realize that they are killing off those who truly believe in them, rather than those who are using the past to perpetuate an ever-living hatred of their brother countrymen. This is the path to destruction - it's the path that I see will lead to another war within these borders, and it won't be with Arabs.
I can go on, but for the sake of brevity I'm going to end this post here. Let's just say that as a Republican, I believe that entitlements only hurt this nation and its people. It stops them from even taking a stab at succeeding at anything, and progressing as an individual. This is the core of why I can't stand what is being promised by our Democrat "friends". Add to that the craziness coming from black preachers aimed at black followers about how they are entitled to this and that, and that they are being held back by non-blacks...and you have civil war brewing. You know who's holding them back...the black preachers and the Great Society that they were promised.
I don't normally post political responses on rswarrior.com, but I needed to this time because of my growing belief that we would really go into the shitter as a country if we elected a Democrat. I also wanted to point out that Obama is not real.